[01:21] Join: brx joined #corewars [02:42] MSG: Ping timeout: 252 seconds [02:43] Join: brx joined #corewars [03:23] Join: |caesar joined #corewars [03:47] MSG: Quit: leaving [04:58] Join: Mizcu joined #corewars [05:58] Join: fiveop joined #corewars [06:13] MSG: <|caesar> Ping timeout: 252 seconds [07:47] How come it's been quiet in here for three days? [07:54] dunno [07:54] * datagram ponders. [09:10] So, have you been having progress over weekend? [09:38] I work on the weekends [09:39] k [09:42] But I have the rest of the night to myself, so maybe I can work on something [09:45] Join: |caesar joined #corewars [10:07] MSG: <|caesar> Ping timeout: 252 seconds [11:54] Join: elkauka joined #corewars [11:56] hi [12:03] Join: |caesar joined #corewars [12:07] hi ceasar [12:07] <|caesar> hi,el [12:07] guess schools out for you today [12:09] <|caesar> :) [12:09] im still sitting here in a lection at universiy of magdeburg [12:12] <|caesar> magdeburg universiy? [12:13] <|caesar> it's cool...lection [12:18] *lecture - but you got the point anyway [12:18] yeah, diablo's child is on the 94nop [12:21] got to go [12:21] bbl [12:21] * elkauka wavees [12:21] MSG: [12:22] <|caesar> bye,el [12:40] Join: Nenad joined #corewars [12:57] Join: brx joined #corewars [13:02] hi brx [13:02] hi [13:05] <|caesar> hi,nen [13:05] hi |caesar [13:06] <|caesar> how r u? [13:06] nice :) [13:08] <|caesar> did u play mud games,nenad? [13:09] Join: Jens joined #corewars [13:09] hi Jens [13:09] :) [13:10] mud games? [13:10] <|caesar> hello,jens [13:10] <|caesar> no,i see a soft called "zmud",and it's for the mud game [13:11] <|caesar> so i want anybody has play it:) [13:11] <|caesar> *i want know. [13:11] I haven't [13:18] Join: Roy joined #corewars [13:18] Hi all [13:18] Hi Roy! [13:18] |caesar: I played MUD's using zMud once (www.merentha.com) [13:18] Hi Roy [13:19] Which seems to be down atm :-S [13:22] Roy: do you know when will Lachi announce rf24 results? [13:22] No idea, I think he started the tournament by now.. [13:23] My two entries didn't compile right, but now they do [13:23] Hello [13:23] hi datagram [13:23] Nenad, Hey [13:24] Nenad, MUD are text based games from back in the day. Still popular in some clicks though [13:24] I did not enter into rf24 [13:24] Its very addictive and fun [13:24] I will enter the next one, hopefully [13:25] Yes but I am super shitty at this game [13:25] And I have mental problems that prevent me from just making a paper or a scanner [13:25] datagram: anything can happen in a multiwarrior arena [13:25] and this was a multiwarrior round [13:26] so, you could've tried [13:26] I'd prefer to win when I know what I was doing, though [13:27] Is there a program out there that will take a step size and tell you how many turns it will take for something to be put in a certain location of memory? [13:27] It would be helpful for learning how to overwrite your own code properly [13:28] You can debug using CoreWin for example.. [13:28] ...or write two lines of python :) [13:28] And there are programs that calculate the 'perfect'stepsizes [13:28] And...what Jens says of course ;-) [13:28] datagram: the only good program that deals with stonesteps is optima , of course [13:29] but you can make your own, if you don't like that one - or make modifications in the source [13:30] Where can I download it [13:30] I don't just want stone steps, though [13:30] I want any type step [13:31] http://corewar.co.uk/software.htm [13:35] Ugh [13:35] Pascal [13:35] DOS [13:36] * datagram runs Linux [13:36] I'll assume corestep is the same thing... [13:36] There are some C-programs, you can compiler under linux [13:36] more or less [13:37] *compile [13:42] datagram: Maybe you want to read http://www.koth.org/info/cwmath.txt , too :) [13:42] I did [14:09] It is quite frustrating to send warriors to 94x. [14:09] I have to wait for ages to get the results [14:09] :) [14:10] try multiwarriorX and you'll die before the scores come [14:10] hehe [14:10] It isn't exactly fun to submit a warrior, when you already know, that it won't enter because of the handshaking [14:11] :( [14:11] well, ar 94draft, only one warrior handshakes [14:11] in multiwarrior, it's more frequent, though [14:11] *multiwarrior = X [14:13] Is there a special reason why no 94X No Pspace hill exists? [14:13] no. I don't know [14:14] I am frustrated about no 94t nop hill [14:14] why? [14:14] with a norma length=100 setting... [14:14] because 94t is very interesting [14:14] and there is no tourney hill at Koenigstuhl [14:14] there is, but LP [14:14] and no LP tourney hill anywhere [14:14] ... [14:16] hehe ... now I've waited years to get a result from 94x and now my warrior gets only a score of 110.4 [14:21] OK, another try, but it is probably worse anyway [14:22] Another year to wait for the results ;-) [14:25] just think about it... a ray of light reflected from your face reaches the sun in ~ 8 mins which is much less than that hill takes to produce results [14:34] hmm 5 points more, but still not enough [14:34] Jens: papers are not than tough at X [14:34] and you haven't optimaxed it, right? [14:34] Somewhere I have to start :) [14:35] :) [14:35] And optimaxing for 94x takes more time than I'm willing to scrifice [14:35] * Nenad agrees [14:36] Maybe we should have something between tiny and 94nop, say 2000 instruction [14:37] and between 94x and 94nop [14:37] It would make the transition between 94nop and 94x easier [14:37] maybe... [14:37] coresize=2667 :) [14:38] Hmm, maybe something mean, where is is almost impossible to create imps like mov.i #0, 2667 [14:39] maybe make a hill that runs combat in two different enviroments, and then takes the average score [14:39] like 94 + 94t hill where each warrior would fight in both competitions... [14:40] hmm [14:40] but I still think that a random coresize hill is an interesting idea [14:40] and we should try it [14:40] it would be very interesting to look at the scoresurfaces there [14:41] You would need quite a many 2d surfaces for random coresize.. [14:41] :) [14:41] Buy me a cluster of several hundreds of computers and I'll answer you such questions [14:42] Mizcu: did you write that 94b report? [14:42] still no [14:42] :( [14:42] will you do it today? [14:42] dunno [14:43] gotta go, school [14:44] Nenad: Take a paper-warrior (94nop) and let it fight against itself, but with pmars -c 5000000. After a while some interesting patterns appear :) [14:44] I know [14:45] I already pointed that out some months ago [14:45] hehe ... you know, that I'm kind of slow :) [14:45] I even wanted to do a research project about the stability of paper systems [14:45] and? [14:45] the other guy that I talked to, a physicist, wasn't very interested after all [14:46] I need someone with knowledge about chaos theory [14:46] (I think) [14:47] some papers become preiodic jumpers, some turn themselves into imps, some suicide... [14:48] Wouldn't be knowledge about cellular automats better [14:48] *automata [14:48] some have "strange attractors" where many processes are.. [14:48] maybe [14:48] but the question that I asked was: is the general behaviour of a paper chaotic? [14:49] and how chaotic [14:49] Hrm, the first paper I tried was RotPapers3 just now, it turns into a mov.i #1, how much does the system depend on starting values. Do small changes in values tend to, in average, produce large or small differences in spread pattern and score [14:50] Roy: most papers with mov bombs become that way [14:50] Roy: Take hullabaloo [14:51] hrm, that one too [14:51] another question: WHEN will it happen? [14:51] after how many cycles... [14:51] is there a way to predict that? [14:51] and so on... [14:52] Nenad: Depends on how soon you start the project ;-) [14:52] it would be nice to have a good model of paper world in corewar [14:52] well, I am still interested in that. but I can't do it all by myself [14:53] btw, evolved papers are very interesting, try watching those, too [14:54] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cellular_automata - Nice to read :) [14:54] Join: Fizmo joined #corewars [14:54] MyFirstPaper suicides. [14:54] hi Fizmo [14:54] hi [14:54] Hi Fizmo! [14:54] Yay, very pleased with my new version of Mandragora :-) [14:55] dat the hill [14:56] Nenad: already in progress :) [14:56] still on the way [14:56] The GarbageCollector likes it ;) [14:56] I got it improved by nearly 8 point against 94nop fsh [14:57] so, what's the score [14:57] ? [14:57] Could someone please kill Larger than Infinity. I don't want it to HFB [14:57] still at 136 [14:57] *to kill HFB [14:58] Fizmo: Do you know a warrior called Gemini Dream? [15:00] sounds familar to me [15:00] but don't remember what it is [15:01] <|caesar> bye,all [15:01] bye, caesar [15:02] Part: |caesar left #corewars [15:02] Fizmo: I stumbled upon it, when looking at old 94nop-results. It is the first warrior to pass the age of 100. [15:03] Unfortunately it doesn't seem to be published :( [15:08] hmm, there are a lot of unpublished warriors in the past [15:10] :( [15:10] Join: elkauka joined #corewars [15:11] hi [15:11] hi elkauka [15:13] hi [15:48] ok, gotta now. Back later the evening [15:48] * Fizmo waves [15:48] MSG: [15:49] * Nenad waves to Fizmo [16:03] Join: brx_ joined #corewars [16:06] MSG: Ping timeout: 252 seconds [16:06] Join: brx joined #corewars [16:08] MSG: Ping timeout: 252 seconds [16:16] Just got the first result from RF24. [16:17] I'm sorry Nenad .... [16:17] Well, not really ;-) [16:17] ? [16:18] First warrior to be knocked out: VoyagerBullet by Nenad [16:18] oh :) [16:18] that was expected [16:18] are the results online? [16:18] r.g.c? [16:18] yes [16:18] I only made one serious entry [16:18] I only made one entry [16:19] where are the scores at rgc? I don't see any [16:19] me either [16:20] but I am a little worried, though... Jens: did you submit something papery? [16:21] In r.g.c. aren't any results yet, only a little message about VoyagerBullet being knocked out [16:21] where? I can't see it. [16:21] in which thread? [16:21] Nenad: Are papers a problem? [16:21] http://groups.google.com/group/rec.games.corewar/browse_frm/thread/e53e00a1f95c765b/5116910a0b914459#5116910a0b914459 [16:22] VoyagerBullet is a oneshot, isn't it? [16:22] no [16:22] just a stupid ccpaper [16:22] paper fights are expected... [16:22] :) [16:23] I don't know if oneshots can do any serious damage in cs=40000 [16:23] only if they strike really quickly [16:23] so I guess that most of the people submited papers... [16:23] yes, I would say the same [16:24] Is your other warrior a paper, too? [16:24] but I am worried because my paper in the second warrior has the same values in all csizes. [16:24] no it isn't [16:24] it is a pspacer [16:24] depending on coresize [16:24] in large cs it is a pure paper [16:24] in medium, it is a oneshot [16:24] and in 8000 [16:25] it switches between s/i and a oneshot [16:25] but it probably won't survive till 8000 ... :( [16:25] that's what I'm afraid of. that paper will lose too soon [16:26] I've send a little defensive paper in the hope to survive as long as possible [16:26] something like yap? [16:26] no [16:27] I've sent a not so defensive paper, because I hope to get some wins if I'm lucky ... it throws the usual dat bombs around [16:27] It is triple booted 3-silk-paper [16:27] *is->is a [16:28] well, there's no way to tell what's going to happen ... the papers aren't optimized, so it is a gamble [16:28] how does your warrior perform in cs=8000? [16:29] I predict the following: The second warrior bein knocked out is: Happy Fluffiness by Jens Gutzeit [16:29] Nenad: one moment ... I benchmark it now [16:30] ... I predict: The second warrior that dies is: Klug by Nenad Tomasev [16:30] and all that pspacing will be in vain... [16:34] hehe [16:34] ? [16:34] hehe because of what you've said "and all that pspacing will be in vain..." [16:35] oh. :) I thought that you've seen a good score of your warrior [16:39] cds: 163, clr: 98, pap: 104, pwi: 100, pws: 105, sai: 115, sbi: 111, scn: 137, stn: 142 -> avg: 120 - nothing fancy, I was aiming for the last place anyway [16:39] Wow, I survived one round :-) even though one warrior is completely randomly chosen constants [16:40] Does anybody know how long it takes before the next round is finished? [16:40] * Roy submitted two papers [16:40] No idea.. ask him :-) Its a shame he isn't on IRC atm to announce it realtime [16:41] yes. it would be nice... [16:41] I post that to r.g.c. Maybe he reads it :) [16:41] we should make a post at rgc to invite him here [16:41] :) [16:42] done [16:43] Roy: Anything special about your papers? [16:43] if Roy submitted some intelligent pwi, we're doomed [16:43] Hmm, one is Maelstrom, and the second is a cool new thing that doesn't work on 94nop (yet) [16:44] Nenad: We are doomed [16:44] But I don't want to spoil it, there is a short article about it comming in the next CW [16:44] whenever that is [16:44] Nenad: We are even more doomed [16:44] Nah, not doomed, I think the new thing is knocked out pretty soon [16:45] that is nice thinking, Roy. [16:45] And Maelstrom only works when the core is 8000, then the imps kick in... [16:45] So, who is next to be knocked out? Any bets? [16:45] I bet on me [16:45] * Roy bets on NewThing [16:45] I don't have confidence in unoptimized papers in strange coresizes [16:46] Do any of you have experience with RSS? [16:46] what is the problem? [16:46] it sounds like a politische partei [16:46] I never used a aggegrator before, but I would like to start using it [16:47] what is RSS? [16:47] Its a way to collect news, its the new hot thing on the web! [16:47] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RSS [16:47] r.g.c has a RSS-feed [16:47] what? [16:47] where? [16:47] So you can see/read messages instantly [16:47] Google has it: http://groups.google.com/group/rec.games.corewar/feeds [16:48] oh ... that [16:48] Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh, a nationalist right-wing Hindutva group in India [16:48] =RSS [16:48] Google is pretty fast now, it was very slow [16:48] Nenad: take the first link [16:48] Jens's message is already in the feed... so its very quick [16:48] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RSS_%28file_format%29 [16:48] Jens: I know, but that one is more fun :) [16:49] Most modern news-sites have rss-feeds so you can see whats happening and be up-to-date in the fields that intrest you [16:49] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SoV - hehe [16:50] It seems, that we should change the page [16:50] Yeah, also a good way to get traffic [16:54] I think that it'll be some time before we get the results of rf24... how many rounds did he say he'll run? [17:04] 2 * 200 [17:04] wrong [17:04] 5 * 200 [17:04] http://groups.google.com/group/rec.games.corewar/browse_frm/thread/29dc15be679ec970/01eead94df28b3db#01eead94df28b3db [17:04] And for 10 warriors we have maxcyles = 400000, which will take quite a while [17:23] I have to go to eat something... I'll be back later to have another peek at the rf24 results update [17:23] * Nenad waves [17:23] * Jens waves [17:23] MSG: [17:24] By the way, how it is decided, that make the next rf-round? [17:24] *that->who [17:24] *makes [17:25] I think Fizmo does that, he organises the whole bunch [17:26] But if you have a idea and you want to organise it, fimzo will quickly say "yes!!" [17:32] 7 challenges left until i got my first 100+ warrior [17:32] I'm trying to do my best [17:33] MSG: Read error: Connection reset by peer [17:34] Nice..! [17:41] Join: elkauka joined #corewars [17:42] Roy: ? [17:42] for Nenad: I'm off for today, try your boot and send it to 94draft as test please :-) [17:42] yes? [17:42] "Nice ...!" What is nice? [17:42] elkauka almost having his first 100+ warrior [17:43] :) [17:43] elkauka sounds very much like the dutch uilskuiken.. hehe, I always think of that when he's online [17:44] and what does that mean? [17:44] uilskuiken? [17:44] goofball/dummy :-) [17:44] lol [17:45] Thats why its so funny [17:45] Nick Change: elkauka changed nick to el_kauka [17:45] hehe [17:45] I'm joining ... [17:45] Nick Change: Jens changed nick to NotJens [17:45] Nick Change: Roy changed nick to Jens [17:45] Nick Change: el_kauka changed nick to Roy [17:45] hehe [17:45] Nick Change: Jens changed nick to elkauka [17:45] yeah [17:45] lol [17:46] Woo! [17:46] Nick Change: elkauka changed nick to Jens [17:46] Now who is who!? [17:46] We should do that more often [17:46] Nick Change: Roy changed nick to elkauka [17:46] Nick Change: Jens changed nick to Roy [17:46] Nick Change: NotJens changed nick to Metcalf [17:46] Nick Change: Roy changed nick to Jens [17:46] Nick Change: Metcalf changed nick to Roy [17:46] log-readers: have fun! [17:47] Damn ... and I thought, I could kill HullabaTwo now ;-) [17:47] It doesn't work [17:47] Nick Change: Roy changed nick to NotJens [17:47] ;kill Flu.. [17:47] Err.. [17:48] why would you like to kill it? its koth *confusion* [17:48] Nick Change: Jens changed nick to Roy [17:48] So, Jens, what do want to do now. [17:48] jens? who? [17:48] Join: KponaJI joined #corewars [17:48] Nick Change: KponaJI changed nick to Metcalf [17:48] Hi [17:48] lol [17:48] Hehe [17:48] \o/ [17:48] Hi John, you've missed the fun-part [17:48] Have I missed much? [17:49] Fun? :-( [17:49] Nick Change: Roy changed nick to Fizmo [17:49] yes! [17:49] :-) [17:49] * NotJens Roy [17:49] Nick Change: NotJens changed nick to Roy [17:49] Nick Change: elkauka changed nick to Neo [17:49] Grrr... [17:49] You've missed this [17:49] Nick Change: Roy changed nick to elkauka [17:49] Who's who? [17:49] Hi John [17:49] Nick Change: Fizmo changed nick to Nenad [17:49] I'm Nenad.. [17:49] Nick Change: Neo changed nick to Roy [17:49] Nick Change: elkauka changed nick to bvowk [17:49] Nick Change: Roy changed nick to elkauka [17:49] I might not be here for long because there is a major fire just across the road [17:49] Get it? :) [17:49] Nick Change: Nenad changed nick to Roy [17:50] * elkauka just got his body back ;-) [17:50] What? [17:50] Hi Bvowk [17:50] What kind of fire? [17:50] Nick Change: bvowk changed nick to Jens [17:50] Has you automated evolver gone crazy [17:50] Oh, hang on that's not bvowk [17:50] Its elkauke/jens and Roy here :-) [17:50] no, bvowk!! [17:50] Flames and fire engines, that kind [17:50] Uilskuiken/Jens and Roy I mean.. [17:50] Metcalf: Doesn't sound good. [17:51] Hopefully nobody is hurt, then its fun to watch :) [17:51] Shouldn't be anyone hurt. It is the closed down cinema [17:51] Pity I can't set up a web cam for you [17:51] Yes, why don't you have a webcam ;-) [17:52] Jens: each successful challenge result actually gives you the average age for two different challenges. [17:53] Thanks for the email by the way :-) [17:53] Did it contain anything usefull? [17:53] I've only just got to the internet cafe, I'll download it to check through at home. [17:53] Hopefully it will reveal something [17:54] Metcalf: Nice idea, I'll try to use it for the next graph. [17:54] Bvowk's automated evolver keeps sending the same warrior over and over :-( [17:54] Thats bad :-( [17:54] if got a new superstition concerning 94nop. the first 4 warrior missing strategy line - thats the key to become koth! [17:54] Metcalf: I've gone throught the weekly posts to r.g.c and found some new successfull challenges :) [17:55] No, thats proof redcoders are to lazy to type a simple ;strategy line [17:55] Metcalf: Only the length of the warrior is missing [17:55] Jens: just add on the age of the pushed off warrior and subtract 20 ;-) [17:56] I've already updated the image at http://corewars.jgutzeit.de/history/94nop.en.html, but not the data of the database [17:56] I'll do that with the next major update (search engine, better interface, less bugs) [17:58] The interesting thing is, that if we keep on killing all the old warriors, we will soon have the youngest hill for years. [17:58] * Roy is off to play Catan! [17:58] Err ... we have the youngest hill [17:58] Point Nenad to the message I left him in the log ;-) [17:58] since 2000 or so [17:58] Roy: will do [17:59] * Jens waves [17:59] MSG: [17:59] * Metcalf waves [18:00] sf won't be happy. Pushed off by bvowk's 5th submission of 2097-6922-xt430-7-nano-eve78 [18:01] Hmm ... let's hope, he doesn't wipe the whole hill [18:01] jens: you yet don't know...the vamps are going tostay forever on the hill and taking the hill age to new maxima [18:01] It isn't scoring that well, soon he will just be pushing off copies of his own warrior [18:01] :) [18:02] elkauka: No, that's what HFB is for! [18:02] elkauka: Remeber, HFB is my first +10000-warrior :))) [18:02] Here come more fire engines! [18:02] Does the complete city already burn? [18:03] na. if the complete city burns he would be able to hang around in here [18:05] Metcalf: you should add a nick for me in your who's who: NotJens [18:06] :-) [18:06] ... and maybe: Roy, bvowk, elkauka and Metcalf ;-) [18:06] Helicopters now! [18:07] and ufos? [18:08] Not yet, but they're bound to be on their way. [18:08] Please keep us informed, any Harmless Fluffy Bunnies? [18:08] Further for them to travel I believe. (They all come from Russian) [18:08] hehe [18:10] where does in innocent fluffy bunnies come from? [18:12] Are fluffy bunnies really innocent? [18:12] I've read Watership Down, I know the truth ;-) [18:16] I've called them Harmless/Innocent in order to distinguish them from those bunnies, which aren't :) [18:17] Jens: I think JKW wrote gemini dream in 5 minutes - so maybe he didn't save the source code [18:17]