[01:20] MSG: [03:54] Join: brx_ joined #corewars [03:56] MSG: Read error: Operation timed out [04:00] Nick Change: brx_ changed nick to brx [08:02] Join: anonymous joined #corewars [08:03] Hi [08:03] :) [08:12] * anonymous wonders [08:58] where be you brx [12:32] Crikey! [13:08] where be you anonymous [14:28] Join: Mizcu joined #corewars [14:29] Hello [14:29] :) [14:29] hi [14:32] Magic! [14:48] How be the Jens [15:40] hrm [16:52] brx! [16:52] Wow! [16:54] Join: Core29 joined #corewars [16:55] Hello [16:55] :) [16:57] How be the Core29? [16:59] Spendid! [16:59] Part: anonymous left #corewars [17:31] Join: sf joined #corewars [17:31] Hello [17:31] hi sf [17:31] Hi Mizcu [17:32] Do you read the logs? [17:32] If you do the sorry for all the stuff which wasn't about Corewar [17:33] i dont really read the logs at all [17:33] :) [17:33] sf: don't worry. I am currently debating miss worlds with miz [17:33] I don't think my opinion would count if I had one [17:34] well on one thing it would [17:34] http://stweb.ait.ac.th/~wmaitina/009%20Miss%20China%20and%20Mr%20Indonesia.jpg [17:34] michal and me think we could easily win with such competition :) [17:35] This is a joke right? [17:35] what do you mean? [17:35] no [17:37] Has anyone else solved the puzzle about the two old friends and the three daughters? [17:37] sf: when john comes online the next time, we will let him try [17:38] but no, since you solved it, nobody. [17:38] I thought about asking mizcu, but I doubt he is one for riddles [17:38] Have you tried Jens? [17:38] he is gone for a week [17:39] http://www.missosology.org/2003/missuniverse03_10.html [17:40] Ask Neo if he turns up. [17:40] michal: mexico, south africa / mizcu: israel / brx: panama, peru [17:40] in order of preference [17:41] sf: I tried writing the camhunting script [17:41] :) [17:41] but google is giving me trouble (captchas) [17:41] Join: bvowk joined #corewars [17:42] hrm. [17:42] Hello Bvowk [17:42] hello [17:42] sf: ask him. [17:42] Brx has a puzzle for you [17:42] sf: you pose it. [17:42] the answer is 11! [17:42] I would just paste the one from the log [17:42] so would I. [17:43] I plan on going to bed early, so I have no time waiting for bvowk's reply :P [17:43] You paste it then, multiline paste is a pain [17:43] I can wait an hour or so. [17:43] well.. I can go look at the logs myself if you tell me what I'm looking for [17:44] bvowk: look for " * sf solved the puzzle, doesn#t think anyone else can solve it" [17:44] and scroll up a bit [17:44] http://www.koth.org/irc-logs/2006-02-11.txt 17:59 [17:44] it's actually not that hard. [17:44] Have you found it, can I start the timer? :) [17:45] Have you been away bvowk? [17:47] 12, 3 and 2? [17:48] Why? [17:48] that was quick. [17:48] why 12 3 2? [17:48] I guessed the oldest would have to be about 12 to be "just starting".. [17:48] Sorry, got to have a solution based on logic. [17:49] I used to have piano lessons! [17:49] which is to say, the answer is wrong. [17:49] * brx too [17:49] and violin! [17:49] and flute! [17:49] I was much younger actually, when starting out with piano [17:52] hrm. [17:55] ok.. how's 9, 4, and 2? [17:55] as from the map it looks like 15th st is the lowest numbered intersection on telegraph ave [17:56] Well if you keep guessing you'll get there eventually [17:56] its true.. there's not that many ways to get 72 from 3 products. [17:56] But you'll need to say why it's the right answer, and you don't need to look up any information, it's all in the question [17:56] in the exchange at least. [17:57] kauka actually ended up looking for the answer on the prof's wiki page [17:57] *wikipedia [18:00] augh. [18:00] oldest one? [18:00] 8, 3, 3? [18:00] congrats [18:01] Why? [18:01] cause its the only product of 72 that has 2 of the same age.. [18:01] ... [18:01] I don't know what to say, sf. [18:02] That doesn't sound like the correct way to get the solution [18:02] well.. the only one with two *YOUNGER* girls the same age.. [18:02] That's better [18:03] One minute quicker than me [18:03] he is wrong [18:03] 18 2 2 [18:03] thats true.. [18:04] but that wasn't the order I had my list sorted in :) [18:04] your answer was correct anyway, just tell us why :) [18:05] didn't I just? [18:05] No actually [18:06] well since there is also 18, 2, 2 which fulfills your conditions, your conditions are incomplete. [18:06] oh.. well the oldest *ONE* made me think that the youngest two would have the same age.. and I saw that one 8*3*3 in my list, and since you both indicated that 12 was too old to just be starting piano.. [18:07] (and I honestly didn't see 18,2,2 :)) [18:07] Bvowk: start again [18:07] :P [18:09] :P [18:09] After all this time I've only just noticed I can /msg myself [18:09] lol [18:09] That will come in handy [18:09] talking to yourself is a bad sign. [18:10] bvowk: you probably overlooked the final constraint. [18:11] which is? [18:11] I didn't exactly take a terrically logical track [18:12] I just made a list of 72's and guessed the most likely ones :) [18:13] bvowk: the two twin combinations must have the same sum [18:14] 2 2 18 = 22 / 2 4 9 = 15 / 2 12 3 = 17 / 4 6 3 = 13 / 8 3 3 = 14 / 2 6 6 = 14 [18:14] both you and sf got that one last and picked up on the twin constraint earlier [18:14] when I solved it I the sum constraint was the first thing I noticed. [18:15] The professor knew what the sum was, but still didn't know the ages. [18:15] Therefore it had to be one of the sets of ages with the same sum. [18:16] The fact there is an oldest one in the correct set gives the answer. [18:18] naw.. I dismissed the sum as useless info like the telegraph ave bit ... [18:19] and I haven't been away SF.. just not on IRC lately [18:20] Join: Roy joined #corewars [18:20] What have you been up to? [18:20] Hi Roy [18:20] Nothing :P [18:20] Hi [18:20] Roy: have you solved Brx's puzzle. [18:20] not so much.. [18:20] If you haven't don't read the log [18:21] I've been playing with a few machines... [18:21] toying with my new evolver framework.. but its not solidified yet [18:21] finally got my 4TB raid going.. [18:21] had to get a new mommy board before it would smarten up.. but its rock solid now :) [18:22] and going mad performing partial fraction expansions.. you'd think they'd make the quiz problems on my math course not require 30 minutes of repetitive algebra every single damn question.. [18:23] Evolver? Will you be evolving for nano again? [18:23] * sf hopes so [18:24] oh.. and I've spent a couple nights destroying people on a samurai shodown III machine [18:24] bvowk: are you sure there isn't an easier way to solve them? :) [18:24] yeah.. I was going to fire it up again.. but I figured I should rewrite it first.. [18:24] sf: not if I want to get marks for it :/... I've got the apply the method. [18:24] You're slowing dropping off the nano hill [18:25] yeah.. [18:25] I'll quickly drop everyone else off when I get it right tho :) [18:25] heh. [18:25] (I got access to about 600 processors in the last little while) [18:26] I came to chat about the distributed island evolver thats been on rgc tho [18:26] bvowk: I doubt it, the opponents are too diverse [18:26] oh, my and roy's idea. :P [18:27] have you guys twiddled with he who asked not to be mentioned's dmars scripts? [18:28] Where are they? [18:28] bvowk: I don't know if you can get anything of value out of us. I am currently highly opinionated against it and roy is not opinionated at all. [18:28] sf: er.. running sal? :) [18:28] * brx shakes head [18:28] Oh, I think I've used those [18:29] I think I'm about to use them again now [18:29] I was thinking however.. it sounds quite a bit like a p2p project.. [18:29] you could have upload/download ratios.. [18:30] so each node maintains its own hill, and takes warriors it generates and submits them to other nodes it knows about.. [18:30] if it wins, it can take a warrior from the hill on the remote node it doesn't have.. [18:31] that way there'd be limited transferrence between nodes, and the most effective nodes would have the best information about the competition.. [18:31] but they would also be the best sources to gain information if you were a lucky, but less effective node [18:31] bvowk: how would you enforce that protocol? [18:31] might make for a very interesting game.. [18:32] well, it'd be based on how the other end did... if it beat your local nodes hill, pushed something off, you'd let it take one warrior.. [18:33] you'd send it the one it asked for.. [18:33] your submissions would be known to the other end of course.. :/ [18:34] but thats not such a big deal if you're evolving.. if it was against humans.. that'd be a different story :) [18:34] yes that is one problem. and it would be incredibly easy to cheat :( [18:35] well.. thats not really cheating.. [18:35] 19:32 < bvowk> well, it'd be based on how the other end did... if it beat your local nodes hill, pushed something off, you'd let it take one warrior.. [18:35] 19:33 < bvowk> you'd send it the one it asked for.. [18:36] 1) how would the other node know what to ask for? 2) how would it know if it got the correct one [18:36] and not total trash. [18:36] well.. I was assuming the warriors would be identified with a hash.. so it would pick the highest ranked hash that it did not already have in its collection [18:37] well.. on the other hand.. if you cheated, it would be really easy to blacklist your node :) [18:37] 19:33 < bvowk> your submissions would be known to the other end of course.. :/ [18:37] or flip about the other way, and go for invitation only nodes.. [18:37] that might be the key to implement a kind of rating system for individual nodes and their submissions of requested warriors [18:39] well.. I was also assuming everyone would sign the warriors they created with the nodes public key, in a dated format.. so it would be possible to know where warriors sprung forth from.. [18:39] however, there's always cheating clocks I guess. [18:39] as far as I understand roy, he just loves the idea of an open evolver net. I have been trying to direct the idea to something with another aim besides "quick evolving with an island model" since that doesn't require the network at all. [18:39] but like I said.. cheaters won't play for long.. [18:40] well.. the open evolver would be really neat.. because it would prevent the stagnation of single approaches [18:40] if everyone was running different evolvers.. it would really be an interesting exercise [18:41] true enough, but what does the one with a lesser evolver contribute to the net or get from the net of benefit [18:41] diversity? [18:41] sf: that doesn't help his problem. [18:42] well.. if he's a crappy evolver, the better evolvers will plunder him.. and he'll get a cache of better warriors to use for seed/benchmark [18:43] while that may not make up for being a poor evolver, he'll at least get a source of viable benchmark material [18:43] (since submissions are known to the node they're sent to) [18:43] yup [18:43] How about a server and the battles are run on the server, so no code is disclosed? [18:44] true enough. but that sure as hell doesn't require such a network. there are many sources for good and viable benchmarking material, and the diversity issue should be handled by good evolvers internally anyway. [18:44] well.. that eliminates the trading tho.. [18:44] brx: the diversity of a single evolver is limited by its constraints.. [18:44] hello Roy. [18:44] hiya [18:45] Hi [18:45] * Roy is proud, three medals in two days, yay! [18:45] brx: yeah.. but with such a network, it could be autonomous.. [18:46] so you could start your evolver/node, and it would generate and trade with the others while you were online.. [18:48] and the evolver and the network don't have to be the same program.. [18:49] it could be as simple as having the evolver know where the p2p widget keeps its files, and rankings.. [18:49] I will go fetch some food now. roy, talk about the net and introduce whatever I proposed to you in private. [18:49] bbiab. [18:49] bvowk: that was the idea. [18:51] yes, that was just what we wanted, one central server with a fixed IP, other evolvers login and get URL's, and then you can P2P with other evolvers, only having to send/recieve warriors (and maybe some other information) [18:55] central server means only one hill tho.. [18:55] instead of having a hill for every node.. [18:56] No, not really, you can have other hillsnodes etc, but you have to have one central IP to connect to right? [18:56] You can't just search all Ip's until you find a node to connect to ;-) [19:02] Tell that to Emule [19:13] Join: michal joined #corewars [19:14] hi michal [19:14] ni Roy [19:14] hi [19:14] Hi Michal [19:16] hi sf [19:16] and everyone [19:16] hey michal [19:17] bvowk: I have tried to explain why that is not a real issue when choosing p2p over a server based approach. [19:57] Join: willvarfa joined #corewars [19:58] evening all [19:59] Hi Will [20:00] hi will [20:04] MSG: Quit: Bersirc 2.2, for external use only. [ http://www.bersirc.org/ - Open Source IRC ] [20:04] Join: sf joined #corewars [20:04] welcome back everyone [20:04] You all suddenly vanished [20:05] * brx coughs [20:12] this distributed score surfaces; does it all work automatically, the network thing and all? [20:13] yup [20:13] yes [20:24] hmm useful tech for evolving worlds ;-) [20:26] hey wil [20:28] hello! how goes? [20:29] not so bad.. [20:29] yourself? [20:29] still putting down floors? [20:31] nope, now I get to stand on them! [20:31] heh [20:31] how goes ccai? [20:31] not much at all right now :) [20:32] I'm rewriting it from scratch right now.. [20:32] its going slowly.. [20:32] but I think it'll be far better when I'm done. [20:36] MSG: Quit: using sirc version 2.211+ssfe [20:36] interested in swapping warriors with other evolvers? [20:36] ah [21:06] MSG: Remote host closed the connection [21:15] Time to go [21:15] * sf waves [21:15] MSG: Quit: Quick! Kill your client! Bersirc 2.2 is here! [ http://www.bersirc.org/ - Open Source IRC ] [21:53] MSG: Quit: Trillian (http://www.ceruleanstudios.com [22:42] MSG: Quit: BitchX: coming soon to a theatre near you! [22:43] Join: John joined #corewars [22:43] Hi [22:43] hello john [22:44] I'm only here for a quick visit today. 30 mins or so [22:44] I'm tired [22:44] so am I. tired and bored to death. [22:45] bored? With the entire net at your disposal? [22:45] There must be something to entertain you [22:46] like what [22:46] I can't think of anything right now :) [22:47] I have had enough riddles too. for a few days at least. [22:47] Riddles? [22:47] Have you blogged about them? [22:48] I'm thinking about adding a new section to my links page for blogs belonging to Corewar folk :-) [22:48] no, I might link to them though. me and sf have solved a few and asked other people in here to solve them. [22:48] sf enjoys it more than I do I think :) [22:49] The two men and two doors kind of thing? [22:49] It's fun making puzzles too. [22:49] two men and two paths, it was. [22:49] the latest one we had in here was two doctors and their daughters [22:49] I'm no good at making riddles, but I can mak Suduko etc. [22:50] Have I heard it before? [22:50] (out of bvowk, michal, judo, kauka, sf, only sf solved it satisfyingly) [22:50] satisfactory [22:51] I'm surprised more people didn't get it. It's not a trick question is it? [22:51] not really. [22:52] it's not that hard either. [22:52] :-) [22:52] They're the worst ones, when you realise how easy it is afterwards [22:52] and it's not one of those tiring riddles [22:52] bvowk? [22:53] I missed him, is he coming back tomorrow. [22:53] maybe. he came to talk about evolvewars [22:53] Okay, show me a riddle [22:53] the daughter riddle? [22:54] If it's about April and May I know that one :-P [22:54] it's not *that* simple :) [22:54] :-( [22:54] Okay [22:55] oh the riddle site is down [22:55] * brx greps the logs [22:55] I can't access quite a few sites from here :-( [22:56] 18:59 Local Berkeley professors Dr. Demmel and Dr. Shewchuk bump into each other on Telegraph Ave. They haven't seen each other since Vietnam. [22:56] 18:59 Shewchuk hey! how have you been? [22:56] 18:59 Demmel great! i got married and i have three daughters now [22:56] 18:59 Shewchuk really? how old are they? [22:56] 18:59 Demmel well, the product of their ages is 72, and the sum of their ages is the same as the number on that building over there.. [22:56] 18:59 Shewchuk right, ok ... oh wait ... hmm, i still don't know [22:56] (the answer is in the logs, so careful) [22:56] 18:59 Demmel oh sorry, the oldest one just started to play the piano [22:56] 18:59 Shewchuk wonderful! my oldest is the same age! [22:56] 18:59 How old are the daughters? [22:56] At least one is a prime age! [22:57] At least one has an age which is a power of 2 :-) [22:58] And the age of the third girl should be easy to calculate once you know the other two. [23:00] * brx believes john will break the record [23:00] There are five possible combinations of age. [23:02] Wait, I'm getting to far ahead [23:03] Dr Demmel and Dr Shewchuk could be married [23:03] lol [23:04] That way Dr Shewchuk knows her oldest daughter is the same age as Dr Demmel's even though she has doesn't actually know what the ages are. [23:04] no [23:04] And they are both blind, which is why they haven't seen each other since Vietnam [23:05] john! [23:05] It fits perfectly [23:05] come on, solve it! :) [23:06] There aren't five possible solutions at the point Dr Shewchuk doesn't know, there are six [23:07] only 2 minutes left to break the record for that riddle :) [23:07] 8 3 3 [23:07] done [23:07] huh? someone still awake? [23:07] now explain :) [23:08] Dr Shewchuck knows the sum even though we don't [23:08] yes [23:08] continue [23:09] Join: Miczu joined #corewars [23:09] Knowing the sum isn't enough so it has to be one of the two possible combos with the same sum [23:09] * brx nods [23:09] If there is an eldest daughter it has to be 8 3 3 because 6 6 2 has two the same age [23:10] Although I suppose it is possible to have two kids 11 months apart, who are the same age in year, but one is obviously older. :-) [23:11] :) [23:11] Next! [23:11] MSG: Ping timeout: 252 seconds [23:12] do you know the 100 prisoner riddle? [23:12] Nick Change: Miczu changed nick to Mizcu [23:12] No [23:12] Just spent over hour just surfing and searching for stuff [23:12] What kind of stuff? [23:13] http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~wwu/riddles/intro.shtml [23:13] that's the link to the riddle page, page is unbelievably slow at the moment [23:13] Can't connect [23:14] yes me neither [23:14] .1. .6. [23:14] 2.. ..5 [23:14] --- --- [23:14] 3.. ... [23:14] ... ..6 [23:14] --- --- [23:15] 5.. ..4 [23:15] .3. .1. [23:15] I made a Suduko [23:15] a) founded out that there IS a systema-training group, and in Helsinki, excellent. b) Found out where to get Wushu-shoes c) and at same street that previous store is an excellent Thai-Ethnic foodstore [23:17] My company sells Ethnic veg :-) [23:17] there are 100 prisoners in a jail. the jail director has to shut down the jail and thinks of a game to decide the fate of all prisoners. there is a room in the jail no prisoner can see from his cell. nor hear. the cells are isolated from each other too. so, single prisoners are randomly chosen and brought into that room for a random amount of time before being led back to their cells. there is a lamp in the room initially off. every time a prisone [23:17] nicey nice [23:18] now, they may discuss a strategy the night before the game begins. what should they settle on? [23:18] That cuts off mid-sentence brx [23:18] John: where [23:18] cut off at every time a prisone [23:18] every time a prisone [23:18] every time a prisoner is taken out of the room he may choose to assert that all prisoners have at least once been in there. if that assertion is correct they are all released. if it is wrong, they are all executed [23:19] And I have to choose a strategy for them? [23:19] yup [23:22] actually you may already solve it without knowing the initial state of the lamp [23:22] (on/off) [23:22] your choice :) [23:22] * brx grabs some food [23:23] Well I can give a solution if the initial state of the lamp it not know [23:24] know EQU known [23:27] I came online to look something up but I can't remember what now [23:29] re [23:30] I remembered - just wanted to check how to format something [23:31] mm.. and that requires a check? [23:31] btw if you want to categorize the logs. I suggest using a text search engine [23:31] which is essentially what I did. [23:33] Does anyone have logs between Jaska's stopping and Log_Guy's starting? [23:33] About 06 Sep - 14 Sep (approx) [23:34] Are these prisoners immortal? [23:34] John: assume that they are :) [23:35] i have my logs from the time [23:36] where do i mail them? [23:36] no wait.. [23:36] im watching 2004's logs -_- [23:37] :-) [23:38] this explains why i could remember mister anonymous from earlier this (or yester-) day [23:38] The first prisoner in knows he is first, but the others don't know anything apart from they aren't first. [23:38] [16:55:41] * Added *!*idden-use@82.148.36.37 to ignore list [23:39] the first prisoner in doesn't know he uis the first [23:39] not necessarily [23:39] but you know they can talk a strategy [23:39] beforehand [23:40] sf solved this in about the same time she solved the daughter problem [23:40] I can only solve it for if the initial state of the light is known [23:40] i dont have Sep 10 but yes for others [23:40] well okay, that suffices [23:41] Mizcu, would you mind if I made them available on Corewar.co.uk [23:41] not at all [23:41] just lemme separete them from the big-bunch and mail 'em to you [23:41] I can go through and edit out any stuff you don't want in them, if they logs /msg or anything [23:42] Thanks - [23:42] (hotmail won't work on this connection) [23:43] Do you know of any utilities which analyse web page logs. [23:43] web page logs? [23:43] I can google for one, I just wondered if you know a good one [23:43] Yes [23:43] I know some general search engines, namazu one which was recommended to me. [23:44] it's opensource [23:45] hundreds of lines like this: [23:45] corewar.co.uk: [04/Dec/2005:01:31:56 +0000] 71.101.35.155 - - "GET /infitiny/TBN.RED HTTP/1.1" 200 1214 "http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rls=GGLG,GGLG:2005-42,GGLG:en&q=tiny+black" "Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.1; .NET CLR 1.0.3705; SpamBlockerUtility 4.7.1)" [23:45] the idea would be to compile a few sets of search terms per category and index the pages accordingly based on the search engines results [23:45] oh [23:45] you are talking about that [23:46] no I don't :) [23:46] Okay thanks I'll try google [23:47] I would like it in a more friendly format, so I know how people arrived at my page, what the do while they're on it, which bits are popular, which bits no-one ever finds etc. [23:47] To help me improve it. [23:47] * brx nods [23:47] well, if you paid me... [23:47] :) [23:48] There are some things I am willing to pay for to improve my website [23:49] like what? odds are the solutions to your problems are well known and opensource already [23:49] sent [23:49] Thanks Mizcu [23:50] Mostly graphics [23:50] I don't know how to solve it unless the first prisoner knows he is the first prisoner [23:50] can't you make them yourself? :) [23:50] Eventually [23:51] I actually enjoy doing those things [23:51] what do you need exactly? [23:51] Photos of good looking girls with some kind of redcode connection! [23:51] Redcode tatoo. [23:52] well, sf. [23:52] Maybe [23:52] and catya has some kind of redcode connection too :) [23:52] there is a pic of sf on my blog actually [23:52] I meant a connection in the picture, like they could be playing paper scissors stone [23:52] heh [23:53] Definitely not her [23:53] how do you know? [23:53] :) [23:53] Maybe we should change the terms of cw first [23:53] to uhm... bikini - sand - palmtree [23:53] and then search for pictures! [23:53] maybe that would provide more results. [23:54] Because I know what she looks like, and her hair is dark [23:54] Damn you John... [23:54] :-) [23:54] and is she slimmer/cuter ? :) [23:54] No comment [23:54] hehe [23:57] What's the name of the girl who writes viruses? [23:57] you sound as if she was popular. I am not aware of any. [23:59] I think there are quite a few.. [23:59] 17-year-old girl writes virus and takes a stand