[05:58] mornin [05:58] moin [05:59] finished updating... now testing (means, i try writing a warrior *G*) [06:00] uh.. [06:00] fluffy: I got a strange question to ask you about pycorewars [07:22] every warrior i write scores 75..85pts with wilkies *grrr* [07:24] familiar barrier [07:25] first warrior i made to break the barrier well was monowire.. [07:27] well, if you need consulting, then just ask [07:28] thanks a lot, i'll do... do you think i should use an optimizer, or can i go without for now? [07:28] you can go without now [07:33] hah! 94pts [07:33] let me guess, silk-paper [07:34] sil the ones, who split before mov? then yes [07:34] are silk... [07:35] but i find it hard to find some useful attack code [07:35] depends what you want to attack [07:35] youre funny, i have no clue, what is out there *g* [07:36] mov.i b, <1234 | bomb: dat <2667, <5334 [07:36] dat <1, {1 and dat <1, <-1 are not bad either [07:37] imps are used often? [07:38] almost always with stones [07:38] bluefunk being example in wilkies [07:39] but the chance to have 100pts score with imps is very high, i suppose? [07:40] not really [07:40] the imps offer defence from papers, while the stone bombs scanners [07:40] and if the imps used are imp-spirals, they can also help in offence [07:41] i dont understand, why DAT <1, {1 is a good bomb [07:42] try running a djn.f 0, <-100 in a core [07:42] and put a jmp #1, 1 against it [07:44] http://koti.mbnet.fi/mizcu/corewars/redcode.htm <- stoney the second at the bottom of the page scores 140 wilkies [07:46] its scores 122.75 against wilfiz, and maybe 100 against koth'nop [07:47] i can see the trees, but not the forest [07:48] djn.f has a decrementing "tail", called the djn-stream [07:48] however, the djn-stream meets a something 1,1 , the djn wont jump and a process will fall from it [07:49] i just dont understand, where the big difference is to "straight forward" written warriors [07:49] well, i will take small steps *g* [07:50] to known your components, to know your steps, to be able to balance multi-component warriors [07:53] it helps to know a number of components to use [07:53] mhm [07:53] or small component-parts [08:23] why would you "put a jmp #1, 1" against it? or did you only try to demonstrate the effect of the djn stream? [08:25] yes [08:25] the djn-stream will die when meeting something with a and b fields of one [08:25] not every program overrun by a djn stream will be defected [08:25] ah [08:26] thus dat <1, {1 -bombs will be more efficient against programs that use djn-streams (most stones, for example) [08:28] wow [08:28] 98.33pts [08:30] any reason for the predecrements? [08:31] in case the bomb hits something, the predecrement will cause additional damage [08:32] and it makes no difference to you if the decrement is there or not [08:33] now i know why its "redcode" - because you are programmers from hell, arent you? [08:33] you have to ask that from bvowk [08:34] like a shrapnel bomb *g* [09:45] 106 on wilkies [09:48] 125! [09:48] tweakin' the paper distance [12:09] Join: Fluffy joined #corewars [12:09] :) [12:11] :~) [12:14] Got a cold? [12:15] anti-MNS [12:15] So it is more a LNS? [12:15] Large Nose Syndrome [12:16] :-|) [12:27] Any problems with ARES so far? [12:27] And when did you test ARES with Wine? [12:27] found a bug in the mars tonight [12:28] didnt test it by myself.... my linux machine has no x [12:28] What the homepage of ARES again? I'll try to test it with Wine [12:29] http://harald.ist.org/?site=ares [12:29] or ares.com/corewars [12:29] I see, that you've updated the homepage as well [12:29] *ouch* [12:29] ? [12:30] wait a sec, i'll upload the most actual version [12:30] I've unziped the file and it created several directories [12:30] hm [12:30] Why don't you use sth. like ares-xxx.xxx [12:30] it is easier to move/delete/whatever [12:30] ? [12:31] I've unzipped you file and it created the dirs ares_system, benchmark, manual, ... [12:31] when i unzip it, i get a folder with the name of the archive, containing the rest... you know, i am a stupid windows user [12:31] i will mention that on the download page [12:32] ok, ignore me then, because ares is usually used under windows :) [12:33] Hey, it seems to work [12:34] I like the way you show the core [12:35] download ares 2.34b, some features added, bugs removed... [12:35] In any case you can say now, that ARES works under Linux with Wine 0.9.27 [12:35] hope i have no serious bugs in .34, did not check it, but i used it today for writing a warrior [12:35] *g* [12:36] technically, ares is a simple program [12:36] Yes, but there are two things that I miss [12:37] 1) a help button on most dialogs [12:37] which might be useful for beginners, who don't know what to do [12:38] 2) Some kind of help system, which shows tips on how to use ARES on startup [12:38] hmm ... does Help/A.R.E.S. Tutorial work under Windows? [12:38] i want to integrate the stuff from the web page, when the content is finished... this is the help [12:39] can you use the bookmarks? try sal [12:39] tutorial works here [12:39] Yes, bookmarks work with Firefox [12:40] i used some browser wrapping object, the tutorial reads out the source after loading a page and checks for special html comments to start further actions in the UI [12:40] did sal open in an extra window or within ares? [12:41] It opened a new tab in my already running firefox [12:41] (I've configured Firefox to open new tabs instead of new windows.) [12:42] sal should load into the intrgrated browser... some other links open an external browser... you can configure that [12:42] ok ... where? [12:42] menu simulator/options/bookmarks [12:43] Ok, I now see the problem [12:44] It is Wine related and I'll try to fix it later [12:44] tell me, if you find a procedure to tell others using wine [12:45] That might not be a good idea. I'm using LFS, where you compile everything manually and don't use any kind of package manager. [12:45] And I don't think that there very many LFS users out there, who want to play with corewar [12:46] An idea for future ARES versions: It is possible to directly download&run warriors from Koenigstuhl? [12:46] i could implement that [12:47] the easier alternative would be to copy some more warriors into that ARES zip file [12:48] Can I zoom into the core? [12:48] Join: John joined #corewars [12:48] Hi :-) [12:48] Hi John [12:48] you can zoom _out_ [12:48] hi john [12:48] Hi Fluffy, Ares [12:48] options/zeus [12:49] ares: a zoom of 4x is that much [12:50] ares: If I want to work with tiny/nano, it might be good idea to show more factors [12:50] i designed ares for very large cores in the beginning [12:50] ... or zoom into parts of the core [12:50] when i had no idea, of what is going on out there [12:50] :) [12:50] i like limits [12:50] :) [12:51] please try the "external assembly" option - options/compiler... i really want to know, if this works [12:52] in answer to the question about assembling the code with pmars, but not running it - pmars -r 0 [12:52] what does it do? [12:52] uses pmars.exe (0.9.3) [12:52] 6 [12:53] thx john [12:54] I was getting bored at work today, so I finished early [12:56] ares: External assembly doesn't work [12:56] i have the same problem here [12:56] ares: ERROR: Warrior has ZERO length [12:56] (I've use Harmless Fluffy Bunny from 94nop@Koenigstuhl) [12:58] Join: Core_old joined #corewars [12:58] Hi Core_Old [12:59] hi! [12:59] :-) [13:02] i took v2.34 from the web page... asm version is still showing 2.0 instead of 2.1 and i will check the external asm problem, before releasing 2.34b [13:08] hmm... some files just dont get compiled woth pmars, thats why "zero length" is reported [13:09] it might be a good idea to the user specify a path to the pmars executable [13:09] *to let the [13:09] i wanted to be sure, that the one delivered with ares is used [13:10] ok, but that will probably not work with Wine [13:10] because i dont know, if the output of all versions is equal & machine readable, using the -V option [13:10] I'll test it as soon as you say, that ARES is working again :) [13:10] its strange, some files get compiled, others that worked before, dont [13:11] sounds more like a problem of ARES than one of pmars [13:11] probably a problem with the call [13:11] surely not a problem with pmars - it worked yesterday [13:12] Then it is Happy Bug Hunting Time for now :) [13:12] the benchmark compiles the problem-warrior [13:13] did you look into the calculator? [13:22] no, I didn't [13:25] -V output is changing from warrior to warrior !? [13:28] http://harald.ist.org/?site=ares&page=.DEBUG showing the different results when pmars is run with -V [13:29] in the first case, the output starts with the loadfile (line 3) [13:30] second case gives the loadfile output somewhere near the end [13:30] never noticed that [13:30] i can search the output for the string Program "xyz" (length... [13:31] that's probably the best solution [13:31] it looks like a bug, especially because the loadfilething shows inbetween the "label references" [13:31] but why do you want to use -V anyway [13:32] i need the source file line number for the debugger (execute while marking the related line in editor) [13:32] ok [13:42] hm... gotit.... fluffy: check the .DEBUG link again [13:43] downloaded [13:44] and its pmars 0.9.2 [13:54] and... working? [13:58] I don't see any pmars [13:58] in ares_system dir? [13:58] did i forget it? [13:58] no [13:59] you've only send my the ares.exe, is that correct? [13:59] as replacement for the one, you downloaded as ares2.34b.zip [13:59] on, I've done that [14:01] funny - when i click a link at koenigstuhl that points to a .red file, ares pops up automatically loading the thing *g* [14:01] your requested option was already implemented *g* - okay. this wont work under unix, i suppose... [14:01] I haven't tried [14:02] you'd need to "register file types" - this writes registry keys to \HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT [14:11] back from not-so-quick nap [14:15] MSG: Quit: Trillian (http://www.ceruleanstudios.com [14:24] http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3892077515889404347&q=corewar [14:24] Who would want to watch that video? [14:26] who loaded it up?? [14:26] Hmmm... not the most interesting of videos [14:27] Maybe we should have a competition - best Corewar video [14:27] You could do a video tutorial, or article, or a video showing a warrior being created [14:27] fluffy - maybe you try WELCOME.red and put it to youtube [14:28] ares: no [14:30] mandelbrot-hill [15:09] * John waves [15:10] MSG: Quit: mov.i #1,1 [15:21] * ares waves [16:24] fluffy? [16:24] hi bvowkston [16:24] hey miz [16:28] Hi bvowk [16:46] there, i just extended the stone-article [16:46] http://koti.mbnet.fi/mizcu/stonearticle.txt [16:47] You seems to collect all useful articles for beginners :) [16:47] nah [16:52] just doin m [16:52] ' job [16:53] however i have no motivation to participate in this tournament-round for some reason [17:01] hey fluffy [17:01] I did have problems with it... but I just figured out what was going on [17:10] :) [17:12] I was having trouble with my valhalla warriors getting corrupted [17:12] but it turns out I forgot a : in one of the [] [17:12] 's [17:12] (just one.. so it took a long time to find it!) [17:12] I hope that you'll soon start submitting warriors [17:12] I know that kind of bugs :-( [18:28] * Fluffy waves [18:29] MSG: Quit: fluffy.i < 1, # 42 [21:07] Join: Fluffy joined #corewars [21:07] :) [21:10] aye, fluffball [21:12] hrm [21:19] John: current best @146.79 :) [21:22] * Fluffy is finishing quickvisi [21:22] t [21:22] * Fluffy waves [21:22] MSG: Quit: fluffy.i < 1, # 42